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hllon4whls
Apprentice Modder




57 Posts

Posted - 11/09/2008 :  21:08:39  Show Profile
The barbie jeep was the first PW that we paid anything for. $40 at a consignment store. Was told that it worked 100% just needed a charge. Well charger and battery were toast, but new 17ah battery, some quick wire modding and she is on her way. But she cant steer the thing, at all. Can steer the quad and later the harley, but the Jeep steering escapes her.

Anyway found that the steering is difficult, so took a few steps to rectify. Made some good progress, but still have some issues. I was inspired by this thread, but didnt go quite this far. http://www.modifiedpowerwheels.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=396

I took a look a the weak points. Got the steering wheel off and looked at the whole works in pieces. First thing I tried was making the rod offset more offset. I didnt realize it, but this was a step in the wrong direction. I was thinking I was creating more leverage, but I was putting the load further away from the pivot point. I lengthened the steering linkages, reorganized the steering quite a bit and changed out the rivets to 1/4" bolts. I also took out the steering wheel stops and tied the metal bar into the plastic "frame" by adding a couple 1/4" bolts, achors it a bit.

I snapped a few pictures. It came out as I designed, but I'm not sure it works as planned. I think that increasing the offset was counterpoductive. I dont know if the longer steering points added to the spindles makes up for the mistake or not.





It seems easier to turn as she can actually turn it some now, but the hollow backside of the steering wheel is still hurting her fingers. I had another kid (6yrs old) that said the same thing. I was thinking of getitng another slightly larger wheel, but finding one that small I think would be a challenge.

I'm ready to abandon the jeep all together and move the motors over to something with handlebars. She loves the harley and has a smaller 6v non PW quad that she also likes (except for the peg leg). Having multiple powerwheels and super long runtimes is really popular at parties and gathering as well as its a lot of fun for me tinkering.

I'm on hold right now as what to do next. If I come across an appropriate steering wheel, I'll go that route. As long as its the right size and weldable, I can make it work.

wheres
Journeyman Modder

Cary
NC
USA



475 Posts

Posted - 11/09/2008 :  21:23:51  Show Profile  Send wheres a Yahoo! Message
Suggested thread for you: http://www.modifiedpowerwheels.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=5004&SearchTerms=tripod

I never got around to adding the helper bar to my daughter's steering wheel since she kinda outgrew the problem but I think it would have worked. In fact, I think if I were still trying to solution this problem I'd just replace the steering wheel altogether with some handlebars. Right now I'm hoarding a rack and pinion front end from an old gaucho, if I ever end up with another gravedigger or anything else that's especially hard to steer I'll be putting it to use..

"where's muh tools..."

92.05 KB

metal frame sahara @ 18V
metal frame safari @ 18V
maroon firebird metal frame wrangler @ 12V (2 pedal)
Baby Baja beetle @12V
Peg Perego Quad w/Gaucho motors and tires @12V
Custom 6WD ARGO/ROVER/TANK
Pink Harley
Black Harley Drag Trike
Extreme Machine - 21Ts 12V
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hllon4whls
Apprentice Modder




57 Posts

Posted - 11/10/2008 :  16:40:19  Show Profile
I saw the tripod R&P thread. I'm not sure I want to go that far to fix this PW. I actually have a cheap tripod that I could cannibalize, but I think its aluminum or plastic and I wouldnt have anyway to mount it to the powerwheels. I may wind up making a butterfly steering wheel. That would give more leverage due to the larger size and may give the same mindset as a pair of handlebars. I dont have a plasma cutter or torch, so its going to take some elbow grease and some sawsall blades to make this steering wheel.

One other thing that I noticed about the stock PW setup is that there is no real anchor point for a pivot. The steering wheel holds the steering shaft in place on the upper end, but the lower end is free to float in its own orbit, slightly guided by the front subframe plastic.
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wheres
Journeyman Modder

Cary
NC
USA



475 Posts

Posted - 11/11/2008 :  07:46:31  Show Profile  Send wheres a Yahoo! Message
I agree, the tripod idea was inspired but would take alot of fabrication to make it work.. let us know if you come up with a simple solution to this, I'm struggling with this vehicle now: http://www.modifiedpowerwheels.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=7124

"where's muh tools..."

92.05 KB

metal frame sahara @ 18V
metal frame safari @ 18V
maroon firebird metal frame wrangler @ 12V (2 pedal)
Baby Baja beetle @12V
Peg Perego Quad w/Gaucho motors and tires @12V
Custom 6WD ARGO/ROVER/TANK
Pink Harley
Black Harley Drag Trike
Extreme Machine - 21Ts 12V
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gseric69
Moderator

Red Lion
PA
USA



6315 Posts

Posted - 11/11/2008 :  08:33:15  Show Profile  Visit gseric69's Homepage
My neighbor has the same Barbie Jeep, and her 3 1/2 year old daughter can't steer it at all. I told them I'd take a look at it when I'm done with my current project. It seems this problem may be pretty common with this Jeep. I'm very curious to see how yours turns out as well.

36V Peg Perego Apache - Project: Super Power Police Jeep, 18V Metal Frame Jeep - Project: Sarge
Dragon/Craftsman Pickup Hybrid (WIP), 18V John Deere Off Road 4x4 (Gaucho, SOLD!)
12V Lil Jeep, 18V Turbo Sun Jammer Jeep, 12V Super 6 F150 Blue Thunder,
18V Lightning McQueen & 12V Lightning McQueen w/Duratrax Motors (Sold)
18V Green & Blue Ninja Quads w/19T's, 18V Dora Quad with 21T's
12V Harley Bat Bike w/Duratrax Motors, 12V Pink Harley (Future Trike)
Future Builds: 12V Xtreme Machine, 12V PW Fire Truck, 6V Wild Thing Super 6 & Mach 5
RIP: 12V Super 6 Suzuki Quad w/Seperate Brake pedal (Decommissioned/Parted)
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hllon4whls
Apprentice Modder




57 Posts

Posted - 11/11/2008 :  19:46:01  Show Profile
I looked at my tripod. Its an ambico cheapo. Its aluminum body and gear shaft. I can't see the pinion gear. The shaft is about 11.5 inches exposed and just under 12 turns on the handle lock to lock. I cant weld it on since its aluminum and I dont have the gas to do aluminum or the aluminum wire.

When fully extended the tripod is around 23 inches long. With the steering wheel to the left and the pinion gear basically around the center of the geared shaft, the only way I can see to use this as a rack would be to use an offset chain or belt drive. That is assuming that the intended use would be a true R&P with tie rods at each end. To use it as a R&P steering box, and basically cut it in half with 3 inches of travel in both directions might be more plausible.

Either way it would be a lot of work and would probably be easier and make more sense to get a steel rack an pinion from some other vehicle.



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hllon4whls
Apprentice Modder




57 Posts

Posted - 11/12/2008 :  06:29:46  Show Profile
Double double post post.




Edited by - hllon4whls on 11/23/2008 06:11:09
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swhenrik
Moderator

Pengilly
MN
USA



4067 Posts

Posted - 11/22/2008 :  09:58:32  Show Profile  Visit swhenrik's Homepage
The tripod was a crazy idea for a source for a cheap rack and pinion setup, not because it's easy to mount.

Setting it up like a typical R&P has no benefit over a setup with one solid tie rod from wheel to wheel, and one link to the R&P unit (like in my thread that you linked to above). The common reason for the 2 tie rods to go directly to the rack, is for proper link length for independent front suspension to reduce bump steer (the wheels turning as they go up and down).

For the steering issue on your Jeep, to get the most from a near-stock setup:

1. Make sure everything turns nice and smooth. Disconnect the steering shaft from the tie-rod and make sure there's no binding in the rest of the parts. Make sure there are no burrs, that the steel brace between the spindles is in line with the plastic, etc. Some have used lube on the pivot points, like tri-flow. I'd avoid motor oil or things like that, as I'm not sure the plastic would like it.... maybe someone else has tried it and can report. And definitely nothing "thick" as it just causes more fluid drag (shear). I've actually used WD-40. It's not a real lubricant, but it does definitely help.

2. You are on the right track for fixing leverage and slop issues. Making the offset on the steering stem longer AND making longer arms at the wheels cancel each other for leverage, but it makes a big difference for reducing slop, and helps a little for reducing loads in the steering parts. But you want to make it so the driver has more leverage over the wheels, which means longer arms at the wheels OR a shorter offset on the steering stem. Maybe rebend the steering stem closer to stock. The goal is to have the steering wheel turn as much as possible for the same amount of the front tires turning.

3. Not Jeep related.... steering with a wheel is WAY different for the kids then handlebars. My kids learned the handlebar steering at about 18 months. They didn't learn the steering wheel til after 2 years. And this is with the super easy to steer R&P Jeep to learn on.

Projects: Jeep, Bigfoot, Lil' Quad, Dora Quad, Dirt Grinder, Nascar, Intro, Ultimate Gaucho
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wheres
Journeyman Modder

Cary
NC
USA



475 Posts

Posted - 11/23/2008 :  03:14:45  Show Profile  Send wheres a Yahoo! Message
I haven't given up on the tripod idea yet. What I am thinking is, you first liberate the rack and pinion assembly from the tripod. Cut the rack so you only have as much as you need for the proper amount of travel, remove the hand crank from the pinion shaft. Mount the assembly on a small flat piece of steel/wood or other suitable material with the pinion shaft sticking through a hole to the other side. A belt or chain drive has been suggested a couple of times.. I suggest just using gears, possibly even gears from a spare gearbox. By whatever means works best, you'd attach a small gear to the pinion shaft, and a larger matching gear to the steering shaft. Run the steering shaft into the flat peice of material positioned so the gears meshed. Man, just when I thought I could get back to sleep I feel another microsoft paint diagram coming on...


52.53 KB

might take some experimentation to the the right gear ratio and to get it mounted at the right angle. I may end up trying to build on of these if I can talk my wife into sacficing a tripod...

"where's muh tools..."

92.05 KB

metal frame sahara @ 18V
metal frame safari @ 18V
maroon firebird metal frame wrangler @ 12V (2 pedal)
Baby Baja beetle @12V
Peg Perego Quad w/Gaucho motors and tires @12V
Custom 6WD ARGO/ROVER/TANK
Pink Harley
Black Harley Drag Trike
Extreme Machine - 21Ts 12V
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wheres
Journeyman Modder

Cary
NC
USA



475 Posts

Posted - 11/23/2008 :  03:16:40  Show Profile  Send wheres a Yahoo! Message
yes yes I know the teeth on the rack are facing the wrong way, cut me some slack, it's 5am and I've been up since 1:30

"where's muh tools..."

92.05 KB

metal frame sahara @ 18V
metal frame safari @ 18V
maroon firebird metal frame wrangler @ 12V (2 pedal)
Baby Baja beetle @12V
Peg Perego Quad w/Gaucho motors and tires @12V
Custom 6WD ARGO/ROVER/TANK
Pink Harley
Black Harley Drag Trike
Extreme Machine - 21Ts 12V
Go to Top of Page
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